34 Andrei Rublev

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Soothsayer
Joined: Wed Apr 26, 2006 2:54 pm

Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#351 Post by Soothsayer » Wed Apr 13, 2016 4:36 pm

aox wrote:I see this thread pop up month to month over the many years, so I am sorry if this question has been addressed and lost in the shuffle, but is there any evidence whatsoever that CC is going to upgrade this to Blu? Where are we at in April 2016 on this?
Years back Peter Becker confirmed that they want to update it and understand the desire for an update, but that the materials aren't there for it.

Martin Scorsese had to spirit the longer cut out of Russia when (I believe) they were still the USSR. I hold hope that somewhere, negatives of the long cut are available. But I also doubt it.

It's been quite a while since I've researched this, but isn't the notion that Tarkovsky preferred the shorter cut a bit assumptive? If I remember right, it's been strongly implied that he praised the shorter cut to appease Russian censors to try and get it released domestically.

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djproject
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#352 Post by djproject » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:20 pm

Soothsayer wrote:
aox wrote:It's been quite a while since I've researched this, but isn't the notion that Tarkovsky preferred the shorter cut a bit assumptive? If I remember right, it's been strongly implied that he praised the shorter cut to appease Russian censors to try and get it released domestically.
Possibly. But I figured if the underlining themes are still present in the 186 minute cut, the shortening was done for pacing. But this is why there needed to be made available a better comparison between the two =].

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solaris72
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#353 Post by solaris72 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:46 pm

Soothsayer wrote:It's been quite a while since I've researched this, but isn't the notion that Tarkovsky preferred the shorter cut a bit assumptive? If I remember right, it's been strongly implied that he praised the shorter cut to appease Russian censors to try and get it released domestically.
In a 1969 interview:
Andrei Tarkovsky wrote:Nobody has ever cut anything from Andrei Rublev. Nobody except me. I made some cuts myself. In the first version the film was 3 hours 20 minutes long. In the second — 3 hours 15 minutes. I shortened the final version to 3 hours 6 minutes. I am convinced the latest version is the best, the most successful. And I only cut certain overly long scenes. The viewer doesn't even notice their absence. The cuts have in no way changed neither the subject matter nor what was for us important in the film. In other words, we removed overly long scenes which had no significance.

We shortened certain scenes of brutality in order to induce psychological shock in viewers, as opposed to a mere unpleasant impression which would only destroy our intent. All my friends and colleagues who during long discussions were advising me to make those cuts turned out right in the end. It took me some time to understand it. At first I got the impression they were attempting to pressure my creative individuality. Later I understood that this final version of the film more than fulfills my requirements for it. And I do not regret at all that the film has been shortened to its present length.
Now, he still was working in the Soviet system at this point, so it's entirely possible that he was saying this to be diplomatic (and perhaps also to preserve some sense of creative ownership of the film, since the 3 hour version won some awards and there was no sign anyone would ever see the 205 minute version), but unless he said anything else on the subject, it seems to me the safest bet is to take him on his word there.

nils
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#354 Post by nils » Sat Jul 02, 2016 6:29 am

By the seventieth anniversary of Tarkovsky - Gosfilmofond (Russian state archive of fiction movies) against the wishes of Mosfilm studio and Tarkavsky's Family issued special limited and not commercial DVD edition with first versions of Rublev and Solaris. Quality for this DVD is not good, but a little bit better than Criterion Rublev DVD release. Some comparison you can see here.

CRITERION!!! Please, let's take rolls from Gosfilmofond and make HD-transfer for 205 min. dir.cut of this movie for release on Blu-ray further. [-o< [-o< [-o<

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jsteffe
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#355 Post by jsteffe » Sat Jul 02, 2016 8:07 am

So how can one obtain a copy of the Gosfilmofond release?

nils
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#356 Post by nils » Sat Jul 02, 2016 9:23 am

jsteffe wrote:So how can one obtain a copy of the Gosfilmofond release?
Force the Criterion company to make hd-release of this :roll: Write, call, ask, require, achieve! Criterion has close contact with Russian Gosfilmofond archive. They came there in 2000 year when filmed footage of Solaris "deleted scenes" for their DVD issue.
Miserable DVD release in letterbox does not make sense for the sixteenth year of the twenty-first century.

ALLCAPSAREBASTARDS
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#357 Post by ALLCAPSAREBASTARDS » Mon Jul 04, 2016 4:43 pm

DVDBeaver: http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film5/blu-ray_ ... lu-ray.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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perkizitore
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#358 Post by perkizitore » Mon Jul 04, 2016 5:18 pm

How does it compare to the Russian blu-ray?

nils
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#359 Post by nils » Tue Jul 05, 2016 1:00 am

perkizitore wrote:How does it compare to the Russian blu-ray?
video identical with the Close-Up issue (Close-Up is affiliated enterprise of Mosfilm studio). I think version of Digital Element is still a little bit better than CU/AE by video. a little bit.

petoluk
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#360 Post by petoluk » Thu Jul 21, 2016 7:42 pm

jsteffe wrote:So how can one obtain a copy of the Gosfilmofond release?
I tried contacting Gosfilmofond about this, but never received a reply...

Meanwhile, I found a copy "elsewhere" :P, took some screenshots, and added them to our comparison here.

Still would like to get my hands on the original DVD, to be able to "officially" add it to the published comparison (this one is just a temp copy not linked from our home page).

albucat
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#361 Post by albucat » Sat Aug 06, 2016 1:19 pm

Filmstruck has the 3:03 minute cut now online in an HD transfer that looks (at least at first glance), frankly, fantastic. Completely different from the 3:25 Passion cut on Hulu with its transfer from forever ago. Hard to say what this indicates for the future.

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solaris72
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#362 Post by solaris72 » Wed Jun 06, 2018 12:23 pm

Now listed as out of print. With Janus premiering a new restoration at Film Forum in August, this upgrade has got to be coming pretty soon.

Werewolf by Night

Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#363 Post by Werewolf by Night » Wed Jun 06, 2018 4:05 pm

Let's hope. It wasn't a previous release, but it took just over 2 years for Dragon Inn to go from Janus theatrical release to Blu-Ray/DVD release.

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knives
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#364 Post by knives » Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:00 pm

This looks like an amazing update (on Sep. 25th) with not just both cuts, but also the thesis film. The later is especially exciting for me as that's the only film I haven't seen yet.

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Roger Ryan
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#365 Post by Roger Ryan » Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:05 pm

knives wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:00 pm
This looks like an amazing update (on Sep. 25th) with not just both cuts, but also the thesis film. The later is especially exciting for me as that's the only film I haven't seen yet.
Yes, The Steamroller and the Violin is a welcomed add - not really the Tarkovsky you get by Ivan's Childhood, but the short is well-made.

I'll be curious to see how much better they can make the long-cut of Rublev look - hopefully, some improvement in contrast can be made.

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zedz
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#366 Post by zedz » Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:22 pm

knives wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:00 pm
This looks like an amazing update (on Sep. 25th) with not just both cuts, but also the thesis film. The later is especially exciting for me as that's the only film I haven't seen yet.
Steamroller and Violin is by far Tarkovsky's least characteristic film, and very much in the vein of 'boy meets tractor' Socialist Realism, but there are faint traces of an interesting visual sense scattered throughout, and it's most welcome to finally have it available in a presumably good transfer.

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djproject
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#367 Post by djproject » Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:24 pm

I am beyond excited for this.

However, my main concern looking at the features list is how it’s all going to fit in 2 Blu discs without entertaining some potentially distracting compression.

Werewolf by Night

Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#368 Post by Werewolf by Night » Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:32 pm

Well, it’s (mostly) black and white and monaural, so that should save some space.

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djproject
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#369 Post by djproject » Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:00 pm

Werewolf by Night wrote:Well, it’s (mostly) black and white and monaural, so that should save some space.
True.

I’m thinking that the 185min will get the higher bit rate as it got the superstar treatment. The 205min will probably get half that (hopefully the downgrade will be just one step). I imagine the features will be more conservative, even if there’s a HD option.

I think it will be fine in the end. After all, this has been a *long* time coming (the last of the in-print non-anamorphic DVDs ... and for me personally, the last “black banner” ones). And I’m excited more than anything about this.

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MichaelB
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#370 Post by MichaelB » Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:54 pm

Werewolf by Night wrote:Well, it’s (mostly) black and white and monaural, so that should save some space.
...and framed in Scope, so if they’re sensible and electronically black out the bars above and below the frame prior to encoding that can save a lot of potential disc space.

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L.A.
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#371 Post by L.A. » Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:02 pm

Just wondering whether this comes to the Criterion UK branch? Not particularly interested of the Artificial Eye disc.

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dwk
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#372 Post by dwk » Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:06 pm

I would assume it'll get a UK release, but isn't this film cut in the UK?

jmj713
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#373 Post by jmj713 » Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:15 pm

Really sad to see no full-length commentary track but otherwise very excited for the long-awaited upgrade!

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Telstar
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#374 Post by Telstar » Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:30 pm

Really looking forward to this upgraded edition, but it seems to be missing some fairly interesting extras that were on the old dvd.
Last edited by Telstar on Sat Jun 16, 2018 7:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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MichaelB
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#375 Post by MichaelB » Sat Jun 16, 2018 3:41 am

dwk wrote:I would assume it'll get a UK release, but isn't this film cut in the UK?
Yes, for open and shut animal cruelty. The 1937 Cinematograph Films (Animals) Act doesn’t make an exception for serious Russian auteurs.

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