What the heck happened?The NWFF has commissioned live scores from a variety of Seattle-area musicians and composers, including Wayne Horvitz, Robin Holcomb, John Atkins (of 764-HERO and The Can't See), Carla Torgerson (of The Walkabouts), the Aono Jikken Ensemble, Lori Goldston (of the Black Cat Orchestra), and koto players John and Elizabeth Falconer. Each score will be recorded live at its NWFF screening, for possible inclusion on later DVD releases.
The Criterion Collection, the DVD company known for its impeccable restorations of world-cinema classics, is in the process of restoring and releasing a number of Ozu films. "Seattle's major contribution to these DVD releases is that we are recording the scores that we've commissioned, recording them live, and they're going to be used as reference material for Criterion when they do go to release these DVDs," said Keeling. "These scores will either be used as alternative soundtracks, or as the soundtracks."
Tomorrow's opening-night film, the 1932 silent comedy "I Was Born, But ... " will be accompanied by Goldston on cello and Elizabeth Falconer on koto. Other films with live accompaniment include "Woman of Tokyo," "Dragnet Girl," "That Night's Wife," "The Lady and the Beard," "An Inn in Tokyo," "A Mother Should Be Loved," "Tokyo Chorus," "I Flunked, But ... " and "Passing Fancy."
Eclipse Series 10: Silent Ozu—Three Family Comedies
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What I want to know is, whatever happened to the live soundtracks that were recorded in Seattle back in '05? Donald Sosin is fine, but I was looking forward to hearing the Walkabouts, Black Cat Orchestra, Wayne Horvitz et. al under the Ozu silents. Remember this (from the Seattle Times):
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Recording silent film scores live is a perilous undertaking, unless the audience is completely silent. Any audible audience reaction becomes a major problem. TCM used to run one of the Garbo silents with a live recorded score ("Love", I think) complete with laughter at inappropriate moments.....yecch!Jack Phillips wrote:What I want to know is, whatever happened to the live soundtracks that were recorded in Seattle back in '05? Donald Sosin is fine, but I was looking forward to hearing the Walkabouts, Black Cat Orchestra, Wayne Horvitz et. al under the Ozu silents. Remember this (from the Seattle Times) ...
What the heck happened?
- TheRanchHand
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- jt
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Does anyone know how many more of Ozu's films CC have the rights to?
As I've already stated, I'm overjoyed at the prospect of getting this set but my only small gripe would be that if eclipse is eventually going to release a dozen more Ozu's, I'd prefer two large box-sets than four small ones. If only because it'll free up the remaining release slots for stuff that we won't complain about.
[I do realise my last sentence is an oxymoron...]
As I've already stated, I'm overjoyed at the prospect of getting this set but my only small gripe would be that if eclipse is eventually going to release a dozen more Ozu's, I'd prefer two large box-sets than four small ones. If only because it'll free up the remaining release slots for stuff that we won't complain about.
[I do realise my last sentence is an oxymoron...]
- Michael Kerpan
- Spelling Bee Champeen
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- davebert
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Not me, sister. Larger boxsets at double or triple the MSRP would be more prohibitive for many of us cash-strapped fans. I still haven't picked up the Ford at Fox box (in this case I want the whole thing for the exclusives, instead of the mini-sets), and probably won't until X-Mas '08. It would also probably not save any remaining release slots... they would just take the extra time necessary to create the packaging and not release any other Eclipse product during that time.jt wrote:As I've already stated, I'm overjoyed at the prospect of getting this set but my only small gripe would be that if eclipse is eventually going to release a dozen more Ozu's, I'd prefer two large box-sets than four small ones. If only because it'll free up the remaining release slots for stuff that we won't complain about.
Color me excited about this release! I welcome wild discoveries from left field, but as a young'un whose film education has really only taken on the past eight years, one home video medium (DVD) and occasional retrospective or classroom screenings, I've still got a lot of catching up to do with even the canonized, over-exposed super-masters.
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Somehow I doubt this will be very difficult to pick up for a while.....but I DID read that however many copies of this set were produced for the release date.....that's IT. Whether that supply makes it to xmas '08, I don't know. Maybe a good thing to pick up during the NEXT Deep Discount sale.jt wrote: I still haven't picked up the Ford at Fox box (in this case I want the whole thing for the exclusives, instead of the mini-sets), and probably won't until X-Mas '08.
- Michael Kerpan
- Spelling Bee Champeen
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When I become a convert to the cinema of Ozu in 2000, these films were utterly impossible to see. "I Was Born But" appeared on video around 2001 -- and went out of print in less than a year. The other films only surfaced during the Ozu centennial in 2003 -- at retrospective showings and in the unsubbed Shochiku box sets,davebert wrote:Color me excited about this release! I welcome wild discoveries from left field, but as a young'un whose film education has really only taken on the past eight years, one home video medium (DVD) and occasional retrospective or classroom screenings, I've still got a lot of catching up to do with even the canonized, over-exposed super-masters.
I suspect even people less fanatic than myself would enjoy most of Ozu's 37 surviving films, if they got a chance to see them (with subtitles). The same could be said about the early work of Naruse and Shimizu, of course.
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I can't believe anyone's carping about this release. I never expected Eclipse's schedule to be "edgier" than Criterion's. I expected Eclipse to serve as a short-cut to get a higher volume of movies onto the market, especially older films where source materials would make it economincally unviable to produce a Criterion-quality presentation. From that standpoint, the Eclipse SILENT OZU box fits the bill perfectly. Also, let's not get too snobbish when reviewing the Eclipse releases so far. Keep in mind that documentaries (by Louis Malle or anybody else) and silent films (by Ozu or anybody else) are always a tough sell. And Raymond Bernard wasn't exactly the hottest name in movies, either. Aside from the Bergman, LATE OZU and Kurosawa sets, it's difficult to point to an Eclipse release and say it had a built-in audience of any size. And surely a FEW Eclipse releases have to have a built-in audience, and sell well, to sustain the viability of the line.
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I am pleased to see more of Ozu's films being made available. I just wonder if Criterion is going to give up releasing Ozu's films under their label as a means of cost-cutting. The Eclipse releases so far have been a welcome treat but often I question whether the cost is justified considering there are no features. In this case, I think the price should be 29.99 for three films rather than 31.99.
I love Ozu and wish for all his films to be available someday but I am concerned that his stature is being reduced in the eyes of the public with these releases.
I love Ozu and wish for all his films to be available someday but I am concerned that his stature is being reduced in the eyes of the public with these releases.
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- Michael Kerpan
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- The Elegant Dandy Fop
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Supplements could be commentaries by real scholars of Japanese film history rather than hacks like Donald Richie. Too often we discuss these films and their aesthetics without discussing the legacy of the man and the times (politics, economics, challenges) which he faced as a filmmaker.
I agree that there are few books on Ozu in English (Bordwell's is okay for a formalist reading. However, his attention to detail fails to place the films in a more useful social and historical context). What is long overdue is an authoratative study of Ozu's life, his films, his philosophies, and his legacy.
I agree that there are few books on Ozu in English (Bordwell's is okay for a formalist reading. However, his attention to detail fails to place the films in a more useful social and historical context). What is long overdue is an authoratative study of Ozu's life, his films, his philosophies, and his legacy.
- Michael Kerpan
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- davebert
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I'm really hoping this is a typo ($39.99?) and we're not quibbling over two bucks.filmnoir1 wrote:In this case, I think the price should be 29.99 for three films rather than 31.99.
And I just realized that with my limited time and always-increasing collection, I haven't had time to watch the Late Ozu set since I snapped it up opening day. This oughta help me re-prioritize my viewing schedule.
- zedz
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Well the difference is that these are (2/3) unavailable silent films from a master filmmaker (who's hardly overrepresented in the US - only one other film has been released that isn't drawn from the final decade of his long career). I thought you'd be the last person to be sniffy about Criterion FINALLY releasing a box of silent films. Given their track record, this could be seen as an even bolder move than the Bernard or Klein sets. The complaints here seem to boil down to gripes over the timing of the release (yes, we want these films, but not now, goddammit), and frankly I can't imagine anything more petty.HerrSchreck wrote:[. . .] almost a month ago to the day zedz wrote on the Delirious Fictions of William Klein thread:
zedz wrote:Now this is more like it. Eclipse releases should get people going "what the hell is this?" For the curious, I think these films have been out in Europe for a while and I'm sure they've been mentioned on the forum several times.
Z you've expressed your own frustrations with the line before, as recently as the last. This month you like the release and have no problems. Sudden En Masse Condemnations of folks expressing their feelings about the current release (which I don't think anyone disapproves of in and of itself, i e the films and their worthiness) and Having A Thread Discussion-- just because You Approve This Month-- uncool brother. I say this because you're normally so frigging examplary... a (Tom Snyder-type voice:) "paragon of Thread Virtue", if you will.
My three sous.
EDIT: Putting it another way, I think the premise of your argument - that Criterion releasing French sound films of the thirties and forties (total number already in the collection: twenty) is inherently bolder, riskier and edgier than releasing Japanese silent films (total already in the collection: one; total already available in R1: one) - is demonstrably false.
Last edited by zedz on Sat Jan 19, 2008 1:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Thomas J.
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Yes, exactly, and if all the existing "special features" such as docus have been used up, then make new ones. After all, getting a Westerner to comment on an Eastern filmmaker, and licensing a vintage documentary and selling it all for $39.99 -- that's hardly "special" added value content. Am I grateful for whatever we get? Yes, but it is formulaic and a bit regressive.filmnoir1 wrote:Supplements could be commentaries by real scholars of Japanese film history rather than hacks like Donald Richie. Too often we discuss these films and their aesthetics without discussing the legacy of the man and the times (politics, economics, challenges) which he faced as a filmmaker.
I agree that there are few books on Ozu in English (Bordwell's is okay for a formalist reading. However, his attention to detail fails to place the films in a more useful social and historical context). What is long overdue is an authoratative study of Ozu's life, his films, his philosophies, and his legacy.
- Steven H
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I have some issues with the shortcuts Richie takes (and has taken), but he's far from a hack. Besides, the man a) knew Ozu personally, and b) is willing to talk about it for an hour or two here and there c) in english. So he has a bit going for him. Most other Ozu authorities didn't know him, aren't interested in doing commentaries, or don't speak english (Criterion being averse to subtitling commentaries unlike MoC.)
The only glaring Ozu extra omission is the Yoshida documentary, but who knows how much that kind of thing costs to license. It's available as it's own $50ish DVD in Japan, so it's probably not something to just get tossed on the back end of a release. Someone probably wants real money for that thing.
The best Ozu extras that haven't been used are his little seen 30s documentaries (including one on Kabuki), fragments, and short films, not to mention extensive material translated from his "notebooks" (which were published in french, though now out of print.) Hopefully these will be included sometime soon. There's still The Only Son (which Criterion has a Richie commentary for) and An Autumn Afternoon at least, so hope springs that those will be tapped (keep in mind that Ozu is almost entirely Shochiku, and it's no coincidence that the best extras come on TOHO releases... I'm just sayin.)
Hang me for it, but if Criterion announced the next Eclipse title as "30s Noir Ozu" or "wartime and/or post-war Ozu" I still might come to the defense. Ozu Ozu Ozu. Ozu.
The only glaring Ozu extra omission is the Yoshida documentary, but who knows how much that kind of thing costs to license. It's available as it's own $50ish DVD in Japan, so it's probably not something to just get tossed on the back end of a release. Someone probably wants real money for that thing.
The best Ozu extras that haven't been used are his little seen 30s documentaries (including one on Kabuki), fragments, and short films, not to mention extensive material translated from his "notebooks" (which were published in french, though now out of print.) Hopefully these will be included sometime soon. There's still The Only Son (which Criterion has a Richie commentary for) and An Autumn Afternoon at least, so hope springs that those will be tapped (keep in mind that Ozu is almost entirely Shochiku, and it's no coincidence that the best extras come on TOHO releases... I'm just sayin.)
Hang me for it, but if Criterion announced the next Eclipse title as "30s Noir Ozu" or "wartime and/or post-war Ozu" I still might come to the defense. Ozu Ozu Ozu. Ozu.
- zedz
- Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 7:24 pm
Since we can fairly reasonably assume that An Autumn Afternoon will be a 'proper' Criterion release (I've been buying these silents on Panorama, so the idea of Eclipse somehow being 'unacceptable' for Ozu films is pretty comical to me), I'd lay odds that the Yoshida doc is being saved for that. It's hard to think what else they could pull out of the hat, having already created a number of solid features relating to Late Ozu. This would mean that yet another master director enters the Criterion Collection by the back door, if you've been counting.Steven H wrote:The only glaring Ozu extra omission is the Yoshida documentary, but who knows how much that kind of thing costs to license. It's available as it's own $50ish DVD in Japan, so it's probably not something to just get tossed on the back end of a release. Someone probably wants real money for that thing.
The best Ozu extras that haven't been used are his little seen 30s documentaries (including one on Kabuki), fragments, and short films, not to mention extensive material translated from his "notebooks" (which were published in french, though now out of print.) Hopefully these will be included sometime soon. There's still The Only Son (which Criterion has a Richie commentary for) and An Autumn Afternoon at least, so hope springs that those will be tapped (keep in mind that Ozu is almost entirely Shochiku, and it's no coincidence that the best extras come on TOHO releases... I'm just sayin.)
I would also guess that The Only Son would mop up any available pre-war Ozu extras already extant or created by Criterion. And I don't really think that most Ozu silents require commentaries or explanatory extras: they're some of the most direct and modern silent films you can find, completely accessible and enjoyable.
- HerrSchreck
- Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2005 11:46 am
Zedz, come on-- I don't expect this kind of stuff outa you. When in gods name did I articulate anything what vaguely had an aroma ofzedz wrote:Well the difference is that these are (2/3) unavailable silent films from a master filmmaker (who's hardly overrepresented in the US - only one other film has been released that isn't drawn from the final decade of his long career). I thought you'd be the last person to be sniffy about Criterion FINALLY releasing a box of silent films. Given their track record, this could be seen as an even bolder move than the Bernard or Klein sets. The complaints here seem to boil down to gripes over the timing of the release (yes, we want these films, but not now, goddammit), and frankly I can't imagine anything more petty.HerrSchreck wrote:[. . .] almost a month ago to the day zedz wrote on the Delirious Fictions of William Klein thread:
zedz wrote:Now this is more like it. Eclipse releases should get people going "what the hell is this?" For the curious, I think these films have been out in Europe for a while and I'm sure they've been mentioned on the forum several times.
Z you've expressed your own frustrations with the line before, as recently as the last. This month you like the release and have no problems. Sudden En Masse Condemnations of folks expressing their feelings about the current release (which I don't think anyone disapproves of in and of itself, i e the films and their worthiness) and Having A Thread Discussion-- just because You Approve This Month-- uncool brother. I say this because you're normally so frigging examplary... a (Tom Snyder-type voice:) "paragon of Thread Virtue", if you will.
My three sous.
EDIT: Putting it another way, I think the premise of your argument - that Criterion releasing French sound films of the thirties and forties (total number already in the collection: twenty) is inherently bolder, riskier and edgier than releasing Japanese silent films (total already in the collection: one; total already available in R1: one) - is demonstrably false.
Who in heavens name compared the risk of releasing french sound films of the Plumteenforties with japanese silents? Who from Honolulu to Ass Crust Valley said anything bout Bolder Riskier & Edgier? We writing for Sassy Magazine or something? We're simply talking about Releasing Filmmakers Forever Overlooked & Bumped Aside By Arthouse Trends/Franchise Directors-- from whatever era and country they may reside. This is not rocket science (its only the mission statement), nor is it as unintelligible as Dutch Schultz deathbed ramblings. It's unique enough, and in conflict enough with the CC line, that they up and created a new line for it.that Criterion releasing French sound films of the thirties and forties (total number already in the collection: twenty) is inherently bolder, riskier and edgier than releasing Japanese silent films (total already in the collection: one; total already available in R1: one) - is demonstrably false
Let's try this another, simpler way. 1) You're happy about Eclipseland this month because you like the release (which I happen to adore myself), and so you see no problems to articulate.
2) Last month (and prior) you articulated a problem with, how you say inna trade, the release material. What was the problem?
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- HerrSchreck
- Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2005 11:46 am
It's not part of the "mission" of the line (Eclipse is where we dump the cruddy looking stuff), but more a byproduct (warning us in advance in other words) of the economics of releasing the work of Overlooked Filmmakers.
Fending off the Image Ent/Kino/Milestone complaints before they come in, in other words. Much of that kind of material, as we know full well, is Dedicated Transfer Prohibitive.
In fact I'd be interested to learn whether or not this Ozu material will be the first time Eclipse bore native Criterion transfers... in other words a pure CC production. Although it's possible also in the Bergman case (they are Bergman Central of course).
Criterion Jr!
EDIT-- davebert, I know this should go on Ford At Fox, but since you mentioned it here, save or borrow and buy it now. Fox already announced that the first printing is IT, and that they're outa inventory already. In other words what's sittting in the retailers right now, once it sells out, end of FAF.
I just bought it from cd-wow (rec'd it day b4 yest), and they admitted that they didn't even have any left, and had to buy it from a third party retailer and resell it to me (not bad considering their price was the lowest I found at the time of purchase.)
Buy it now at all costs! It's the best thing any major studio ever did w the dvd medium. It's totlly worth it, and content wise is right up there w heavy hitters like Treasures/Archives, and Unseen Cinema. DO NOT MISS. Beg borrow or steal!
Fending off the Image Ent/Kino/Milestone complaints before they come in, in other words. Much of that kind of material, as we know full well, is Dedicated Transfer Prohibitive.
In fact I'd be interested to learn whether or not this Ozu material will be the first time Eclipse bore native Criterion transfers... in other words a pure CC production. Although it's possible also in the Bergman case (they are Bergman Central of course).
Criterion Jr!
EDIT-- davebert, I know this should go on Ford At Fox, but since you mentioned it here, save or borrow and buy it now. Fox already announced that the first printing is IT, and that they're outa inventory already. In other words what's sittting in the retailers right now, once it sells out, end of FAF.
I just bought it from cd-wow (rec'd it day b4 yest), and they admitted that they didn't even have any left, and had to buy it from a third party retailer and resell it to me (not bad considering their price was the lowest I found at the time of purchase.)
Buy it now at all costs! It's the best thing any major studio ever did w the dvd medium. It's totlly worth it, and content wise is right up there w heavy hitters like Treasures/Archives, and Unseen Cinema. DO NOT MISS. Beg borrow or steal!
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The Eclipse sets can uniformly be had online at prices that average about 10 bucks or less per film, which seems perfectly reasonable to me.The Eclipse releases so far have been a welcome treat but often I question whether the cost is justified considering there are no features.
I'm also among those who'd much rather have more movies than supplements.