34 Andrei Rublev

Discuss DVDs and Blu-rays released by Criterion and the films on them. If it's got a spine number, it's in here. Threads may contain spoilers.
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ando
Bringing Out El Duende
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:53 pm
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#476 Post by ando » Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:11 pm

ThomasPashko wrote:
Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:22 pm
Here's a weird question, and apologies if this has been answered in the preceding years of this thread:

So, I recently picked up the new Criterion Blu-ray, and am listening to the selected scene commentaries by Vlada Petric (these were recorded in 1998 for the old edition, but I never listened to them very attentively on that disc). In the scene where we see the crucifixion/passion play in the snow, Petric repeatedly refers to Christ in this scene as "Kirill." Are we supposed to infer that this is a passion play where Jesus is played by the ex-monk Kirill (Ivan Lapikov)!? If so, that changes the meaning of this scene pretty drastically, but I don't think that's right. The actor on screen has similarly styled hair and beard to Kirill, but it doesn't look like Lapikov to me. Also, IMDb lists the actor Igor Donskoy as playing "Khristos" (Christ), and I can't think of anyone that could refer to other than the Christ in the crucifixion/passion play. Is Petric just wrong here? Or am I misunderstanding what he's saying?
You're right; Petric does refer to Donskoy as Kirill. When I picked up the latest edition of Rublev I deliberately avoided the Petric commentary as I found it wooden, redundant and rather laborsome when I initially listened to it on the older one. He also tends read overtly Christian symbolism into scenes that, to my mind, are most potent in their spiritual ambiguity.

One thing I noticed, more with the latest edition for some reason, is Tarkovsky's habit of tossing birds in front of the camera when "establishing" a scene. Somewhere I read that T did this in an overhead shot of a village center just to give the view some perspective. But he also does this when Rublev begins to spy on the pagan night ritual where this rationale seems unnecessary.

ari101
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 5:49 am

Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#477 Post by ari101 » Wed Jan 16, 2019 1:48 pm

connor wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:02 pm
Roscoe wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:58 pm
connor wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:44 pm

I've been avoiding this film actually due to this scene, which sounds pretty horrifying. Is it included in the 185 minute cut?
The first half of the shot is in the current Director's Cut version, showing the horse falling off a flight of stairs. The horse is bleeding very badly, clearly gravely wounded. The full length shot, in THE PASSION OF ANDREI, continues after the fall, and goes on to a much more graphic picture of the horse's actual demise. It's not for the faint of heart. It's easily skipped, if you know what to watch out for.
Ironically, scenes like that just serve to take me out of the film, imaginatively speaking. The opposite of the intended effect.
I take your point but for me the film suffers without the cut violence. I love Rublev, and also Stalker, but they are 'hard going' experiences, and the violent scenes jar so much that they leaven the viewing.

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aox
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#478 Post by aox » Thu Jan 17, 2019 12:31 am

What is exactly is comparable in Stalker to that (horse) scene in AR?

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colinr0380
Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:30 pm
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Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#479 Post by colinr0380 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:02 am

ando wrote:
Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:11 pm
One thing I noticed, more with the latest edition for some reason, is Tarkovsky's habit of tossing birds in front of the camera when "establishing" a scene. Somewhere I read that T did this in an overhead shot of a village center just to give the view some perspective. But he also does this when Rublev begins to spy on the pagan night ritual where this rationale seems unnecessary.
Amusingly it even occurs in an abstract form during the Bruegel scene in Solaris!

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solaris72
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 3:03 pm
Location: Baltimore, MD

Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#480 Post by solaris72 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 11:21 am

Wouldn't surprise me if the birds were something specifically inspired by Bruegel, a lot of the mise-en-scene in Rublev feels not too far afield from Bruegel.

moreorless
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 5:34 am

Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#481 Post by moreorless » Wed Jan 23, 2019 3:04 am

ando wrote:
Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:11 pm
One thing I noticed, more with the latest edition for some reason, is Tarkovsky's habit of tossing birds in front of the camera when "establishing" a scene. Somewhere I read that T did this in an overhead shot of a village center just to give the view some perspective. But he also does this when Rublev begins to spy on the pagan night ritual where this rationale seems unnecessary.
There is obviously a strong link between the natural world and the story in Andrei Rublev and I'd say the "bird shot" ends up having different intensions at different points. The Pagan scene for example I felt helped create a more dreamlike atmosphere and perhaps playing up the link between the them and the woodland around them being roused by their ceremony. The slow mo shot during the tartar raid though has ducks used and I think plays up the sense of panic with their struggling to fly not in their preferred environment.

serdar002
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:13 pm
Location: Germany

Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#482 Post by serdar002 » Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:48 am

JM2L has analyzed the differences of original and director's cut

https://serdar0024.wordpress.com/2019/1 ... tarkovsky/

P.S. He now tells me that what's missing is the analysis of the sound differences which are considerable. But he doesn't have the equipment for it
Last edited by serdar002 on Mon Oct 21, 2019 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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swo17
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:25 am
Location: SLC, UT

Re: 34 Andrei Rublev

#483 Post by swo17 » Sun Oct 20, 2019 7:44 pm

Nice, thanks for sharing!

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